EricMilligan

Thanks for the suggestion about Tonal Balance, Fidiu. I actually have the plugin, but hadn't used it. Am working with it now and I think it will definitely help me. Thanks again.

Eric

Thanks for the encouragement. I am embarrassed to admit that I've been at it much longer than you, so the just proves that I'm either a really really slow learner or just plain hopeless. :). I guess my best excuse is that I have a short attention span and really don't stick to one genre. Would probably make better progress if I did

Thanks again,

Eric

Thanks, Ruslan.

Thanks, Jamid. Because I chopped up the acapella and re-arranged the order of the vocal phrases, I changed the "story" of the original version by Jenna - a little bit anyway. It left me in a bit of a box, actually, so I wasn't able to end things up like she did in the original. This version probably needs another verse. But, I think the arrangement does work OK. However, the instrumentation needs work and I guess I really over-did it with processing on the vocals. But, hey, that's one of the real benefits of being here on Looperman. I can get constructive feedback and advice from other members. :)

Thanks again.

Eric

Hi, Danke. Thanks for providing feedback on the track. If you look at the response to Nicolo's comment (HenryPascal) you will see the details about how I went overboard with processing all the vocal tracks in the project. This is NOT the way Jenna's original acapella sounds. Putting on too much reverb is a rookie error. I should know better! :)

I'm going to re-think the approach to the vocals and, as Nicolo suggested, work on the instrumentation to get more variation.

Thanks again,

Eric

Thanks Nicolo for the helpful feedback on the track. Danke has commented on the vocals as well, so clearly I need to make some adjustments. The original acapella from Jenna is nice and clean. I guess I went overboard on the processing.

I layered three copies of the vocals, very slightly offset a few milliseconds to thicken up the vocals. I also applied different EQ settings to each of the three main vocal tracks and some delay, as well as different levels of reverb. Three are also 2 or 3 additional vocal tracks for the "embellishments", heavily processed (e.g., EQ focused on a narrow frequency band).

All of this probably is just too much processing. Too much reverb. This morning, even before I read your comment and Danke's comment I thought to myself that I should've been more judicious in how and where I layered on all the processing.

I also agree with you about the instrumentation being repetitive. I actually realized that and rationalized it by thinking that I got variation from the vocals, but on reflection I think I need to work harder on the instrumentation.

I very much appreciate your advice on the track. I'm going to work on improving it.

Eric

Thanks, LilJuly. I had problems with this one for some reason, despite the fact that Jenna's acapella was really good. Anyway, I do appreciate the feedback.

Eric

Thanks, rednebula.

I am planning to work on the track some more, so will see about setting the melody line a bit higher in the mix. Glad you liked the melody line. It really is meant for vocals.

Sometimes I get frustrated and do the vocals myself, although I am an absolutely horrible singer. But for this track, there was just no way I could do vocals on it. I'm getting some ideas for lyrics. Not much sense getting a vocalist lined up if there are no words! :)

Eric

Thanks, Heath. I don't think trance has to be boring and repetitive, although I agree that some of it is. I like a focus on melody. Perhaps that's why JoeFunktastic felt that this really wasn't trance.

I have had a tendency in my tracks to make the kick too dominant I think. I am trying to dial it down a bit. My wife calls my music "thump, thump music". That's not meant as a compliment, but it accurately reflects the way I have mixed kicks and bass in my tracks.

I think this track would be a lot better if it had real vocals. Just need to work out some lyrics. And, find a singer of course! :)

Eric

Thanks very much Ruslan. Nice to hear from you!

Eric

Thanks very much for the explanation. I use Logic as well. And I also use Ozone. Haven't used the dynamic EQ. I'm assuming that you are using automated EQ to duck beats because the drum tracks in audio files, not midi files. All the tracks in this project are midi, except for the sound effects (boomers).

So, I could get the same result simply by editing the midi information in the drum tracks? Either removing or muting the midi notes for the second beats?

I should use the EQ technique for tracks that are audio files?

Eric

Thanks, Jamid. I've concluded that although EDM seems like it should easy to make, in fact it is very complex. Producers need to master a whole variety of skills to produce something that is good. I have so much to learn, and so little time. :)

Eric

Thank-you for the feedback, Sweetcherries. I'm determined to learn how to do decent trance tracks.

Eric

Thanks for the advice, Nesmanga. I will definitely check out tracks from Perfecto Records. And NES Manga TV on Youtube as well.

Eric

Hi, Nicolo! Thanks for commenting on this track. I've tried for years to make a good trance track. I don't know why it seems to be so hard for me.

I supposed this could be synth pop. I think most of my tracks are probably in the pop genre. I don't feel embarrassed by that. Making a good pop track is not easy. Making a good EDM track is definitely not easy either.

From other comments it looks like I need to do more work on the bass parts and the kick drum track. I have about 3 or 4 kick drum tracks on the project, so there is more refinement required. MPOProduction has suggested, I think, that the kick needs to be tuned properly. I know that's supposed to be really important, at least for some EDM genres. I know how to do that, at least in theory. I guess it's time to practice.

Thanks again for the feedback.

Eric

Thanks for the feedback on the track.

As you can see from my reply to Kyle, I've had trouble getting the low frequency parts of the track to sit right in the mix. If I understand your suggestion correctly, you think I should use automation of tuning on the kick track to lower the frequency. Essentially, tuning the kick to the key of the song? Have I understood correctly?

Eric

Hi, Kyle. Thanks for the advice on this track.

I had written a nice lengthy response to your post, but something went “wrong” and it didn’t post. Lost the whole thing.

So, here is another go at it. I’ve got tinnitus, probably from spending too many years in front of loud guitar amps, a long time ago. Anyway, that apparently means that I probably have hearing loss for high frequencies. Consequently, I probably tend to set those parts a bit higher in the mix than I should. I think things are in balance, but they really aren’t. Anybody with normal hearing would hear the track as being out of balance. That’s not an excuse for how this track sounds, but it might be the explanation.

I actually had NO bass part on this track at all, but added a couple of layered bass tracks to the project pretty much at the last minute. I really never found bass sounds that I thought worked perfectly. The track got buddy real quick, even with compression. I ended up EQing the bass parts a lot to keep them focused and to keep the mix as clean as possible. But, it still was muddier than I had wanted. Clearly, I need to spend more time finding the right bass sounds.

Thanks again for the feedback. I really do appreciate it.

Eric

Thanks for the very nice feedback on the track, Patricia. It's great to see you back on Looperman. It's been a while, not that I should talk. I've been here only sporadically and haven't posted any tracks for quite a while. Anyway, I've often wondered how you were doing and if you would return.

I must tell you that I have been sitting on a partially finished track using your spoken acapella, "Summer Breeze". I actually think it's pretty good, or capable of being pretty good. BUT, I need a male vocalist (baritone) for it. Needs to have a voice like Luther Vandross or perhaps Barry White. So, it has sat on my hard disk for years, unfinished. Very frustrating because I think it could be something worth listening to.

You had a cold when you did that acapella and it gave your voice a husky character that really set the feel of the track. That's what inspired me.

Regards,

Eric

Thanks, Patricia. It's nice to try different genres. I like all kinds of music. Sometimes I wonder if I'd do better if I just focused on learning how to do one kind really well. But, I'm just not that disciplined I guess! :)

I totally agree about Looperman. It is so great to get real constructive feedback from other Looperman members. I also agree about the problem finding good vocals. It is very frustrating. I have, on occasion, resorted to doing the vocals on my tracks myself, but my singing is beyond atrocious.

There must be thousands of decent, but unknown singers out there who would really like to participate on a track, but I have no idea how to connect with them. Also, doing lyrics is a major roadblock for me. I've got lots of tracks with melodies and clear ideas about the kind of vocal I want, but even if I could somehow find a singer, not much point if I don't have lyrics.

I think this is the greatest frustration for me and, now that I think of it, it is possibly the reason that periodically "bail out" from making music - because I just can't take my tracks to the state that I hear in my head. I guess I could hire a vocalist on a site like SoundBetter, but the track and lyrics would have to be really really good to justify that. Not there yet.

Thanks, Topclass! My favourite EDM genre is definitely trance. I guess many of the genres seem deceptively simple, but actually the production work is quite complex. I find that really good trance is very difficult to do and I'm not even close to what the pros can do or what I'd like to be able to produce. But, it really is fun music. Spudsy had some good critiques in his comments a few months ago. I really should try to remix this track and see if I can improve it. It's hard, sometimes, to know when something is "finished".

Thanks again.

Eric

Thanks, Vigwig! Greetings from Ottawa. Very rainy here this week, after an unusually hot and dry summer so far. Anyway, I'm glad you liked the track. Does definitely need more work. Still dreaming of finding good vocalists who would be wiling to work on my stuff. Ruslan definitely makes some very nice loops. An interesting guy. A Russian lawyer working in the UAE, making EDM on the side.

Eric