I like the vocal nuances of this track. They give it atmosphere. It sounds like you did good with the rolling bass. You can add an arpeggiator to one bar of your bass and it will sound "rolling" automatically. Then, side chain that bass to your kick drum. Sounds like you nailed it good here though anyway. The above is just a quick way to do it for any future tracks.
I'm glad I decided to check out your music. Surprised I hadn't heard this before today. This is absolutely wonderful. Really takes me back to the early 2010s. So Nostalgic. I'm going to listen to this the next time I'm cycling off into the sunset. Such a golden, majestic quality about this track. Amazing
Thanks for the comment AF. Very sorry about the delay in responding to you. I was off Looperman for some time and didn't realize you had commented on my track.
Hi, Eric! Nice track. I like it a lot. Maybe you can sidechain the pads and some other sounds you have there and even the vocals a little bit so that the kick shine even more through the mix. But anyway you did a nice job. Keep it up.
Hi, Fidiu! Thanks for the feedback and suggestions. I'm definitely getting the message that I really should work up my courage and try side-chaining elements of the track to the kicks. I used a work-around to avoid doing that with the bass line, but hadn't even thought of doing it to pads, etc. I think that's definitely something I should experiment with. I guess it would give the track the "pumping" sound?
I'm not at all familiar with "Logic Pro" but,
in Ableton you could just make one measure of
what ever you wanted to repeat "Quantize" it, highlight
the measure then just hold CTRL and hit D (duplicate) over
and over till you have as many measures of the phrase as you
want. Sidechain it to your Drum in a compressor and Bob's your
uncle :-).
I really like the power and drive in this track. I was really
curious to see what was going to happen when your waveform takes a dive @ 2:14. It turned out to be an Epic change.
Hi, Jynxz. Pretty much the same method in Logic Pro. I think I actually did about 4 bars of the bass and then duplicated it. Didn't attempt the side chain to the kick because I eliminated the bass notes when they coincided with the kicks. But, I know that, probably the preferable solution, is to use the side chain method so that some of the bass note is present in the track on each beat. I also didn't attempt to tune the pitch of the kicks to the key of the track. That's also something I know I should be doing, but frankly have never done. Laziness. Just pure laziness. :)
I totally understand how frustrating it is.
I prefer not to use ready-made basslines and loops and try to do as much as possible myself.
The first and last bassline I made by stretching a bass in different lengths and using the pitch.
I sometimes try it with a synth by making a tone very dark.
With youtube I always have the problem that they speak english which is not my strong point and they explain everything so quickly.
Must be my age that I don't pick it up that quickly lol
How you tried it is actually algebra to me.
I'm completely free of the rules of music hahaha.
I do and try what comes to mind and if it sounds good then I'm happy .
That's why I often refer to my tracks as the Rita bounce genre lol.
I've just been into music for 3 years.
You can tell from your track that you have much more experience.
In any case, I think your bassline turned out well.
But we ourselves think it can always be better, right?
Greetings Rita
Being "free of the rules of music" isn't necessarily a bad way to be. I read somewhere that Stevie Nicks was advised not to learn about music formally because it might ruin her innate ability to create great songs. Her talent is instinctive. Not sure if that's really the right way to express it, but I think you will understand the meaning.
Most of the time, I have no idea what chords I'm really playing when I'm working up a sequence. And, apparently in one of my older tracks posted here, I did a key change in the track, but was quite unaware that I'd done it. One of the more accomplished musicians here on Looperman commented on it! I was quite surprised. :)
nice work on this exersize, i have no complaints about it and think you did a nice job with the drums and baseline and made the best out of it. keep working at it and maybe experiment with adding your own melodies instead of loops to take it to the next level
i laughed reading the comments when you said you should try some weed to help loosen the track up a bit. i agree with your theory
Thanks, hobertni. Using all those vocal loops was actually a departure for me. I usually play all the melody lines myself on my keyboard. I tend to use midi drum loops a lot, instead of programming my own drums. That's always puzzled me because I actually played drums in rock bands (not professionally) years ago. But, I ##### at programming good drum tracks from scratch.
So yes, I agree with you, using my own melodies would be a good idea. I'll definitely get back to doing that with future tracks.
I spend a LOT of time going through all the vocal samples/loops that came with Logic Pro to find ones that I could use with the track as it was developing. I'm generally not very good working with loops, other. than midi loops. Rolling bass lines seem like they should be simple enough to make, but I really had trouble getting it so it sounded half decent. I still don't know why. Watched a bunch of YouTube videos on how to do it. I thought I should be using side chain compression to "duck" 16th bass notes that coincide with kick drum hits on the first beat of each bar, but that didn't work for me at all. Ended up doing all 16th, and then erasing the midi notes for the first one at each beat in the bar. But then had to adjust the velocity of the remaining three notes to get the right feel. Plus applying a LFO filter preset to get it more locked in sync. I assume that, with practice, it would become a lot easier to accomplish! :)
Hi, dubjoka! Thanks for the comment. Yes, I managed to find pads that were really creamy. Only slight tweaks from the presets. Much more effort on the bass and drum parts. First part of the track has only one bass instrument but I layered four of them for the break section including two Moogs. I know that's not supposed to be good practice, but I think that if you use EQ to focus each instrument on the timbre that is unique to it, the whole sound can work really well. I'm not proficient enough to be able to program the sounds I want from scratch, so layering instruments is a method I use quite a bit.
Thanks for the encouragement, pseudoble! I think I finally have come close to figuring out how to do a proper rolling bass line. Now, just need to get more creative on all the other elements! :)
Thanks for the feedback, Michael. I think the mix was pretty good, actually. Now, I just need to work harder on getting more inventive tracks. I'm working on one now with another LM member that is going to be, I think, quite unique. Not EDM. I really want to be able to make good EDM tracks. I think I need to spend more time listening to what's being put out by the pros. I really like Bob Moses, but there's a lot more out there worth my attention I think.
hello Eric! i think you from an organizational and production perspective this is a nice and flowing piece. my complaint is that it sounds like an exercise, just as you alluded to it in the description. i’d love to hear you loosen the genre conventions and jam — then that rolling psytrance bass could be put to a better test. good to see you man!
This is a valid critique of the track, x stokes, and I really appreciate your input. It’s, frankly, a lot more helpful to get constructive criticism than comments that just say, “great track, man” or words to that effect.
Your observation is aiming at an issue that much more fundamental than mere technical issues with the mix, etc. it’s something that I’ve been increasingly aware of, and frustrated with in my music for some time now. Not very inventive.
I’m not sure how to remedy this. I hope it’s not because I’m just too old to be creative.:(
BTW that is an awesome avatar, I only noticed when you replied. I might actually steal that idea for an album cover, that's how much I like it :D
Regarding "tracks to get played outside Looperman" - hey, I made that journey from "##### track on Looperman" to "decent track on looperman" to "some tracks on youtube" to "some listeners on youtube" to "some people to telling me to bring out an EP"... to doing a small concert of my own songs this weekend.
I mean... I honestly didn't think that was possible even a year ago and now I'm setting new milestones and new goals and while I still think it's all ##### and I don't expect anybody to listen... some people do. So NEVER THINK THAT! Even if you're just being realistic, it can also be nice to be ever so slightly ambitious.
So, long story short, yes, people might play it. You might play it. You might DJ somewhere. Now imagine people standing around on the dance floor and you are starting your latest track and you want to blow their tiny minds - and your intro should tell them PREPARE TO BE BLOWN, EARTHLINGS. Wait, that's not what I meant ;)
So yeah, intros need to be interesting. Good luck :)
Hey, BauBou, you are more than welcome to steal the avatar idea! I did that quite a few years ago. The mugshot number is actually my Looperman member number! :) I thought the tag line in my profile was pretty good as well. Probably the most creative thing I've ever done here on LM! :)
Congratulations on doing the concert of your songs this weekend! That's definitely a serious milestone!
I like it, although the intro is pretty long for my taste. That's something that can be shorter maybe?
Great use of the vocals although I don't like the autotune. That could be in the stock vocal, else I would simply remove it?
Finally I didn't know Moses was called Bob, but he seems to have a nice side job besides splitting the red sea. Great danceable track man!
Thanks for the feedback BouBou. Good point on the intro. I've re-worked the intro over and over again. At this point, I actually don't remember if it is longer or shorter than I originally had it. :)
I think your comment on the intro is a good one, though. Not that I ever expect any of my tracks to get played outside of Looperan, but I do know that listeners want to get right into the track quickly, so long-winded intros are not favoured. I guess I forgot that.
You are right about the autotune being in the original vocal loops. Can't do anything to remove that effect, as far as I know. I did spent quite a bit of time searching the web for vocal Loops from R&B singers who had similar voices and styles, but didn't find anything that I could work with. It's interesting that almost all of what's available now is from high-pitched tenors with pretty much no "rasp" in their vocal delivery.
Outstanding work, Eric, but I would expect nothing less from you. You nailed this backing track, and I would agree with Steve that it will take someone with some real chops to try and match Sigrid's vocals (I think her version of this was the highlight of the "Justice League" for me, haha). Terrific backing track with all of the important elements in all of the right places. Wonderful use of dynamics throughout. Well done. I hope all is well.
Hi, Bear. Thanks for the kind words. I guess you and Steve are probably right about trying to match her vocals. Still, this wasn't a complete waste of time. I actually had fun replicating the backing track.
I think the constant underlying COVID-related stress (not COVID itself) has driven the creativity out of me. Haven't had much interest in composing anything original for quite a while. But, truth is that I've had "lean" periods every once in a while previously, so this might not be COVID-related at all. Am hoping that the spark comes back soon. :(
Really good this. I think this backing track sounds better than the original if I'm being honest, definitely harder hitting anyway. The original backing track does sound a bit dated now though, very much a product of its time.
By the way, you may remember listening to some of my non-featured tracks a while back. Thanks for all your feedback on those, much appreciated.
Thanks, Lek. I had forgotten that I'd left this track still tagged as "featured". I had meant to remove that a long time ago. I guess the original backing is a bit dated, although I definitely admire the way the Sigrid and her producer found an entirely different "take" on Cohen's original version. Minimalist, but powerful. A great contrast with her vocal, particularly as the song builds toward the end, and then dies back again in the final bars.
I don't know why, but it seems I'm gravitating more to trying to emulate stuff that I like (even really old stuff), rather than creating something entirely original. It's like I'm reverting to my teenage years when I was just starting out in music. Learn by copying. This track is a prime example of that.
Am currently working on the version of "Unfinished Sympathy" done by The Six, from Manchester. A really tasty updated EDM version of that classic track. I think is it not well regarded by some Massive Attack fans who consider it to be sacrilege, but I like it a lot.
Hi, Michel. Thanks and Happy New Year to you also. I think that next to "Hallelujah" and "Bird on a Wire", the song "Everybody Knows" is one of Leonard Cohen's most notable songs.
There have been a lot of covers done of Cohen's original, but the one by Sigrid was really unique. And entirely different kind of interpretation.
Cohen's original was kind of defiant.
Sigrid's version, to my ear, starts off communicating more of a defeatist flavour. Resigned to the inevitable. But, gradually as the song continues, the tone changes to become more strident and defiant. And then, settles down again in the final acapella part of the last bar.
Really, a masterful example of a single piece of music conveying a range of emotions.
thanks, Ruslan and Happy New Year to you as well. Hope you are keeping safe. Things are starting to get worse with Covid here in Ontario. Going back into hiding for a while I think. Probably a good time to start making some new music. I've been kind of lazy on that front for quite a while. :)
A very nice instrumental mix of this. I don't think anyone can touch Sigrid's signature vocals on this tune. But hats off to anyone who trys. Nice sound.
Steven
I definitely agree with you on Sigrid's vocal, Steve. Really a unique take on Cohen's song.
I've tried to find info on the producers/arrangers, but haven't been successful. Piano and strings. I think I did add a sound effect hit in some sections, but it's really kind of an usual arrangement.
Used Realivox Ladies plugin for the backing vocals on the chorus section. It worked fine for "every" "body" but not so well for "knows". But, I set it back in the mix so I think it really isn't noticeable.
Thanks, BeatMaker. It does have a nice easy feel to it. But, I need to figure out chorus and bridge sections for it. Hopefully, something will occur to me at some point. Perhaps a few years from now? :)
Thanks for the encouragement, Arloph. The bass is a combination of electric and acoustic.
I'm removing this track from the "featured" list from now on so that I can comment on tracks of other members without pushing this one into the featured tracks pages all the time.
Tempo is 97 bpm. Kind of funny to have it such an odd number. But I've found that, sometimes, just 1 or 2 bpm makes a big difference in the feel of the track and how the groove works. I'm kind of surprised by that.
I know I don't get here as much anymore,
but it seems I should have heard this one.
It has such an "older" feel of a sitcom I can't think of right now.
Love it!!!!! :-)
Don't be so hard on your voice,
you are the best translator of what's inside your head for it. :-)
Nice to hear from you! You could be right. Maybe I unknowingly re-created the theme from some sitcom from the 70's or 80's. That bell melody line that comes in at bar 9 might be the culprit! :)
I have a really bad memory for some things like that. I once used an online plargism checking service to see whether some stuff I had written for my consulting work was actually lifted from some previously published source. Sure enough, what I had written matched something published, word for word. The problem was, I had written the original stuff and had totally forgotten about it! So, I could be copying something I heard years ago when I used to watch sitcoms. :)
Anyway, I will take your advice on no being so hard on my voice. But, the reality for this track is that in my head, the voice I hear is a fine, smooth, R&B vocalist who knows how to deliver a ballad. I just can't figure out what the lyrics should be about.
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
on Falcon Trance 8 by EricMilligan
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
I'm not at all familiar with "Logic Pro" but,
in Ableton you could just make one measure of
what ever you wanted to repeat "Quantize" it, highlight
the measure then just hold CTRL and hit D (duplicate) over
and over till you have as many measures of the phrase as you
want. Sidechain it to your Drum in a compressor and Bob's your
uncle :-).
I really like the power and drive in this track. I was really
curious to see what was going to happen when your waveform takes a dive @ 2:14. It turned out to be an Epic change.
Great track. Faved..PEACE from the SouthEast...
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
I prefer not to use ready-made basslines and loops and try to do as much as possible myself.
The first and last bassline I made by stretching a bass in different lengths and using the pitch.
I sometimes try it with a synth by making a tone very dark.
With youtube I always have the problem that they speak english which is not my strong point and they explain everything so quickly.
Must be my age that I don't pick it up that quickly lol
How you tried it is actually algebra to me.
I'm completely free of the rules of music hahaha.
I do and try what comes to mind and if it sounds good then I'm happy .
That's why I often refer to my tracks as the Rita bounce genre lol.
I've just been into music for 3 years.
You can tell from your track that you have much more experience.
In any case, I think your bassline turned out well.
But we ourselves think it can always be better, right?
Greetings Rita
Being "free of the rules of music" isn't necessarily a bad way to be. I read somewhere that Stevie Nicks was advised not to learn about music formally because it might ruin her innate ability to create great songs. Her talent is instinctive. Not sure if that's really the right way to express it, but I think you will understand the meaning.
Most of the time, I have no idea what chords I'm really playing when I'm working up a sequence. And, apparently in one of my older tracks posted here, I did a key change in the track, but was quite unaware that I'd done it. One of the more accomplished musicians here on Looperman commented on it! I was quite surprised. :)
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
i laughed reading the comments when you said you should try some weed to help loosen the track up a bit. i agree with your theory
So yes, I agree with you, using my own melodies would be a good idea. I'll definitely get back to doing that with future tracks.
Regards,
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Regards,
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
I also like the vocals in it.
How to make a rolling bassline? I still dont know lol.
But we keep practicing right?
Just go on like this.
I spend a LOT of time going through all the vocal samples/loops that came with Logic Pro to find ones that I could use with the track as it was developing. I'm generally not very good working with loops, other. than midi loops. Rolling bass lines seem like they should be simple enough to make, but I really had trouble getting it so it sounded half decent. I still don't know why. Watched a bunch of YouTube videos on how to do it. I thought I should be using side chain compression to "duck" 16th bass notes that coincide with kick drum hits on the first beat of each bar, but that didn't work for me at all. Ended up doing all 16th, and then erasing the midi notes for the first one at each beat in the bar. But then had to adjust the velocity of the remaining three notes to get the right feel. Plus applying a LFO filter preset to get it more locked in sync. I assume that, with practice, it would become a lot easier to accomplish! :)
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Regards,
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Regards,
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Michael
Eric
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Your observation is aiming at an issue that much more fundamental than mere technical issues with the mix, etc. it’s something that I’ve been increasingly aware of, and frustrated with in my music for some time now. Not very inventive.
I’m not sure how to remedy this. I hope it’s not because I’m just too old to be creative.:(
Maybe pot? It’s legal here in Canada! :)
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Great to hear from you! Thanks for the encouragement.
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Regarding "tracks to get played outside Looperman" - hey, I made that journey from "##### track on Looperman" to "decent track on looperman" to "some tracks on youtube" to "some listeners on youtube" to "some people to telling me to bring out an EP"... to doing a small concert of my own songs this weekend.
I mean... I honestly didn't think that was possible even a year ago and now I'm setting new milestones and new goals and while I still think it's all ##### and I don't expect anybody to listen... some people do. So NEVER THINK THAT! Even if you're just being realistic, it can also be nice to be ever so slightly ambitious.
So, long story short, yes, people might play it. You might play it. You might DJ somewhere. Now imagine people standing around on the dance floor and you are starting your latest track and you want to blow their tiny minds - and your intro should tell them PREPARE TO BE BLOWN, EARTHLINGS. Wait, that's not what I meant ;)
So yeah, intros need to be interesting. Good luck :)
Congratulations on doing the concert of your songs this weekend! That's definitely a serious milestone!
Regards,
Eric
on I Cant Lose by EricMilligan
Great use of the vocals although I don't like the autotune. That could be in the stock vocal, else I would simply remove it?
Finally I didn't know Moses was called Bob, but he seems to have a nice side job besides splitting the red sea. Great danceable track man!
I think your comment on the intro is a good one, though. Not that I ever expect any of my tracks to get played outside of Looperan, but I do know that listeners want to get right into the track quickly, so long-winded intros are not favoured. I guess I forgot that.
You are right about the autotune being in the original vocal loops. Can't do anything to remove that effect, as far as I know. I did spent quite a bit of time searching the web for vocal Loops from R&B singers who had similar voices and styles, but didn't find anything that I could work with. It's interesting that almost all of what's available now is from high-pitched tenors with pretty much no "rasp" in their vocal delivery.
Eric
on Everybody Knows Backing Track by EricMilligan
Bear
I think the constant underlying COVID-related stress (not COVID itself) has driven the creativity out of me. Haven't had much interest in composing anything original for quite a while. But, truth is that I've had "lean" periods every once in a while previously, so this might not be COVID-related at all. Am hoping that the spark comes back soon. :(
on Everybody Knows Backing Track by EricMilligan
By the way, you may remember listening to some of my non-featured tracks a while back. Thanks for all your feedback on those, much appreciated.
I don't know why, but it seems I'm gravitating more to trying to emulate stuff that I like (even really old stuff), rather than creating something entirely original. It's like I'm reverting to my teenage years when I was just starting out in music. Learn by copying. This track is a prime example of that.
Am currently working on the version of "Unfinished Sympathy" done by The Six, from Manchester. A really tasty updated EDM version of that classic track. I think is it not well regarded by some Massive Attack fans who consider it to be sacrilege, but I like it a lot.
on Everybody Knows Backing Track by EricMilligan
Michel
There have been a lot of covers done of Cohen's original, but the one by Sigrid was really unique. And entirely different kind of interpretation.
Cohen's original was kind of defiant.
Sigrid's version, to my ear, starts off communicating more of a defeatist flavour. Resigned to the inevitable. But, gradually as the song continues, the tone changes to become more strident and defiant. And then, settles down again in the final acapella part of the last bar.
Really, a masterful example of a single piece of music conveying a range of emotions.
on Everybody Knows Backing Track by EricMilligan
on Everybody Knows Backing Track by EricMilligan
Steven
I've tried to find info on the producers/arrangers, but haven't been successful. Piano and strings. I think I did add a sound effect hit in some sections, but it's really kind of an usual arrangement.
Used Realivox Ladies plugin for the backing vocals on the chorus section. It worked fine for "every" "body" but not so well for "knows". But, I set it back in the mix so I think it really isn't noticeable.
on Lush 80s RnB by EricMilligan
on Lush 80s RnB by EricMilligan
I'm removing this track from the "featured" list from now on so that I can comment on tracks of other members without pushing this one into the featured tracks pages all the time.
on Lush 80s RnB by EricMilligan
on Lush 80s RnB by EricMilligan
but it seems I should have heard this one.
It has such an "older" feel of a sitcom I can't think of right now.
Love it!!!!! :-)
Don't be so hard on your voice,
you are the best translator of what's inside your head for it. :-)
Nice to hear from you! You could be right. Maybe I unknowingly re-created the theme from some sitcom from the 70's or 80's. That bell melody line that comes in at bar 9 might be the culprit! :)
I have a really bad memory for some things like that. I once used an online plargism checking service to see whether some stuff I had written for my consulting work was actually lifted from some previously published source. Sure enough, what I had written matched something published, word for word. The problem was, I had written the original stuff and had totally forgotten about it! So, I could be copying something I heard years ago when I used to watch sitcoms. :)
Anyway, I will take your advice on no being so hard on my voice. But, the reality for this track is that in my head, the voice I hear is a fine, smooth, R&B vocalist who knows how to deliver a ballad. I just can't figure out what the lyrics should be about.
on Lush 80s RnB by EricMilligan
CC