Blige Vs Hill Vs Keys

Posts 1 - 25 of 29
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    neuromancer56 : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Who's the best of these 3? They are perhaps my 3 favorite artists, but I have a hard time deciding which one is best. Also which is the best song, Family Affair, Killing Me Softly, or Fallin'?
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    Spivkurl : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago "Killing Me Softly With His Song" is a very old cover. I have no idea about the other ones. All of these, as far as I know are simply pop divas. who have been made to sound like they have mass media credibility by someone who knows how to make anything sound good.

    So, I ask, why that question? If you like it, you like it.
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    Unknown User : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago They have mass media credibility by someone who knows how to make anything sound good. You really don't know who those women are to talk like that. Mary J. Blige is one of the best to ever do it in RnB. If you don't know who they are, Why disrespect them for? Their names speck for themselves as well even more their singing. You--Spivkurl---Ain't gonna be nobody To the world. Only people on this site, Let's say some is gonna know who you are.
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    Unknown User : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Speak for themselves.
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    Spivkurl : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago So, you are offended, that's okay by me. I've been listening to RnB for almost 38 years now. Nothing is new, everything is rehashed.
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    Spivkurl : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago I do art because I must. It is not for fame or fortune. Just saying....
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    Planetjazzbass : Sat 7th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago These performers never enter my frame of reference period, does that mean I dislike them, does that mean I know nothing about music, does it mean my opinions are worthless, no it just means their not my cup of tea, their not my main musical squeeze, everyone's tastes are different and having a certain point of view doesn't warrant a personal put down either!
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    neuromancer56 : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago I agree that Mary J. is just a blessing to us all, she and Lauryn can bring tears to my eyes. No need to go below the belt. I'd be happy if I knew 1/100th of what Spivkurl knows about producing music. But it does bring up an honest question that I had been wondering about, has anyone from Looperman ever gone on to make it big?

    @Spivkurl: I kind of get it when you say "you must". Maybe a lot of us on here are creating music for similar reasons. I can't really help myself either. I have all of this stuff bottled up inside me that I have never found a good way to express, and music is a way of letting that out. For me it's a frustrating obsession because I don't have the experience yet, and while I can create some pleasant tracks, there is still this huge gap between what I want to express and what I'm able to.

    I had to chuckle at Spivkurl said, because it's also true that there were a lot of resources poured into all 3 of these Divas to make them sound good. They also are all victims of the Pop-ification of R&B though much less so than the R&B artists of today. Glad to see that Mary J's recent album Strength of a Woman is more old school. We need more of that.
  9. 630386
    Unknown User : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago neuromancer56, really? I mean really man, geez! This thread makes absolutely no sense. Comparing artists centered around who is the best is rather juvenile in my opinion. It would be like comparing Aerosmith vs The Rollingstones, vs The Beatles. That's silly and only proves that you may like or prefer one performer or group over another and not much else.

    Okay my disclaimer: I am NOT saying Bleige, Keys, and Hill are on equal footing with The Rollingstone, The Beatles, or Aerosmith, in any way. The context I speak of is the notion that these women are merely pop divas and all three are on or close to some type of peer level footing which is wrong.

    The original "Killing Me Softly" song was performed and released on January 21, 1973 by Roberta Flack, so Hill gets no credit for originality. Next, Keys, she did not first appear as a diva, but as an amazingly talented pianist and song writer. Keys was not known for her singing in the beginning. Blige earlier career favored hip-hop as she faced drug and alcohol problems related to a hard upbringing in the Bronx, NY. Blige, raised and brought up in the church is returning to her original roots. These three artist bring amazing strengths and talents that are unique to each of them. So it would like when Michael Jackson and Prince were compared in the 1980, and why? Why did they feel that was necessary to do? To what end did that achieve favor for Michael over Prince and vice versa. Again speaking only in the context on how such comparisons are silly and useless. I have listened to R&B and Funk for more than 50+ years, and today where we have seen electronic music rise to the highest echelons and peaks in commercial music, I predict we will also see a major music correction in favor of organically played instruments and raw talent because electronic music does not retain its value when stacked up against the artist from the Motown label era of the 60s and 70s let's say. Those Motown recordings are Gold and Platinum and have had a very long shelf life opposed to a trap song that has a mere shelf life of just weeks and then it is forgotten.
  10. 851137
    crucethus : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Yeah I agree with Joe on this one, all 3 artists have unique talents that you should celebrate, but I also see Spiv's point. record company $ certainly helps promote artists to make them available to a wider audience. I prefer Bee Bekare or the Skins, over Mary J and Alicia,(not that those two are lesser artists) but you probably have no idea who she is/they are.
    She (Bee) won a contest for Future music magazine UK as one of the top 3 songwriters in the contest.
    So listen to this one from the NYC band the skins.
    But these two really good artists/band are not getting the record company help nor radio push to make them widespread.
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    Planetjazzbass : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago If you really want to talk about talent and who is the best Shirley Bassey wins hands down everyday of the week..
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    crucethus : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago I love Shirley Bassey. I love the fact she also works with The Propellerheads, and also back in the Eighties with the Swiss group Yello. She has that progressive European musical ideal firmly entranced in her amazing career and is not afraid to take a chance.
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    neuromancer56 : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago @Joseph Funk: I disagree, I think organically played instruments will never be much more than a small niche going forward. 2 reasons. First computers are already replacing humans in jobs. They can drive cars now. It won't be long until they are smarter than we are... give it a hundred years. If that is the case it isn't much of a stretch to think that VSTs will actually surpass real instruments in a decade or so. Also music has become like porn, you can get it for free on the internet. That means there just isn't the money in it for music creators. It is much cheaper to create computer generated music than learn how to play an instrument. You can't argue with economics and technology. Is this a good thing? No it's a terrible thing, but I don't see it changing. Spivkurl sometimes makes me feel guilty for not learning to play an instrument. But then I go on and create another track using my PC again anyway. I wish you were right, because it would be a better world. There already is AI creating complete songs right now, they suck but they aren't much worse than what you hear on the radio.
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    Spivkurl : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Anyone who is not fighting against this "terrible thing" should indeed feel guilty. If you think it is "terrible" than stop it from happening by any means necessary.

    People who continue to do things, or support things, even with the knowledge that those things are "terrible" will be the reason that those "terrible" things are all that is left.

    This is not just about instruments or music, this is about everything.

    Once one comes to the realization that places such as McDonald's are using deforestation and mass extinctions to feed people the very thing which leads to illness, it is up to them to stop supporting them. If they know these things, yet do nothing about it, then they are simply a slave to the consumerist culture. This is just an example. The same idea applies to everything. Doing something wrong while knowing it is wrong is very akin to becoming possessed by a demonic entity.

    If computers are replacing humans in jobs, then what will we do with all of these humans? Aren't they simply expendable? As a result, should we not just stop making music altogether and start up a generative music application on our phone (which we all know is never turned off, ever)?

    So yes, feel guilty, please. Guilt can become a reason to change.

    Back on topic though... there should be no reason to have to chose between artists or songs. If you like it, you like it, right? With that in mind, I don't understand the point of the thread except to get in arguments with people.
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    Spivkurl : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago The idea of "It is much cheaper to create computer generated music than learn how to play an instrument" is also interesting to me. This seems similar to thinking "time is money," which really only relates to do something while getting paid. In any other situation, it simply suggests a lack of patience, as well as a simple neglect of support for natural growth processes.

    It also seems quite similar to thinking that it is cheaper to buy junk food than to grow your own food. With patience and dedication, one can end up with an excess of quality nutritious food with delicious flavor. In fact I have reaped harvest of food which cost no money and took no effort this year... a few seeds from peppers and tomatoes were left in the garden and sprouted, and have been creating fruit all season. On the other hand, junk food may be 99 cents, but there are unseen costs... the medical costs from a life of eating these things... the environmental costs of producing, packaging and transporting them... and the psychological damage from living from food like products instead of natural products.

    Just like someone who has never grown their own food, can not rightly say that it is cheaper to buy junk food - someone who has not started playing a real instrument, can not rightly say that it is cheaper to do computer based music. Do they count the software and hardware upgrades for the rest of their foreseeable life? Do they count the power consumption? Do they count the possible loss of all of their work from a simple glitch or hardware failure? Already in my time using virtual instruments, I have seen many instruments become obsolete due to operating system changes, compatibility problems, etc... Simple software problems have led to massive loss of work or data.

    This does not happen with a guitar or piano for example, since the work is held in my mind of body. If those fail, then I probably won't be worrying about music any more. When I grab a guitar or a piano, I know that I will be able to maintain this instrument, most likely for the rest of my life. Any future cost will be minimal.
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    neuromancer56 : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago @Spivkurl: It's like trying to stop the sun from rising. Am I worried that instruments will be replaced by VST's? Sure. Is that a bad thing? Absolutely. But I'm a whole lot more worried that humans will all be killed by machines somewhere down the road. But mostly I'm worried about the day to day problems my family and I face. What is the solution? Even if you narrow the discussion to what is it appropriate to use computers for in music and what is it unethical to use computers for, there really is no clear cut line to say some activities are legitimate and others are not. Even someone like you with very strong feelings on the issue uses computers in their musical endeavors, you're digitizing your music and uploading it to this website. It's all 0's and 1's. I agree with you in spirit, but I've already been assimilated by the Borg. And you and everyone else on looperman are on the same slippery slope. Might as well enjoy it. I wish I had something to say to put your mind at ease, but the battle has been lost a long time ago.
  17. 2276282
    neuromancer56 : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Maybe the glass is half full. Maybe computers will help artists find incredible new ways of expressing themselves that just aren't possible with physical instruments. Maybe the androids will be so intelligent that they understand our problems and help humans live better lives? Maybe we can eliminate poverty, disease, etc. Technology is incredibly powerful. It isn't inherently good, but it isn't inherently evil either. It's easy to fear the worst, but sometimes all you have is hope.
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    wikkid : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Preach, Joe Funk. I started to write a thesis on here about the same thing, but I changed my mind. This is about expanding one's musical foundations, and that, imho is a personal journey.

    Anyway, true AI story. Bought an iten for less than $10 dollars and the cashier at the counter was using one of those registers that has picture icons, only the thing suddenly went on pause. So I say, "Count it in your head and give me the change."
    Confusion reigned. The cash drawer was already open, and I stood there giving a lesson on how much change I should get. After the cashier got the point (after I proved it was simple math and I wasn't trying to game the system) I got my change. Cash drawer was shut, and lo and behold, the thing worked again:)
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    Spivkurl : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago "But I'm a whole lot more worried that humans will all be killed by machines somewhere down the road."

    - Are you? Are you really? Not enough to do anything about it though, right?

    Ethics and appropriateness have not really even entered into what I am talking about. Simply put, there is no more reason to think that humans will be destroyed by machines than there is to think that these computers everyone relies upon will no longer function due to some unforeseen circumstance.

    Mankind thrived for a very long time without computers. They are only doing individuals as much good as those individuals are allowing. At the same time, much damage to the basic existence as individuals and a society is being allowed in. Wikkid had a good example, and one which I have noticed as well. Another good example is at live concerts... notice how most people would rather hold their phone pointing at the stage instead of watching and remembering the experience.

    An inanimate object can not be inherently good or evil. Those are words that you have attached to them. I am as much in Star Trek as the next person, perhaps more, but that innocence and ignorance of the capabilities of evil in humans makes it more of a joke than some sort of thing to be counted on.

    I use computers often. I have four desktop systems in my home. I love FL studio, I love CD creator, I love creating albums with a computer to help me. I also know that it is simply a temporary thing, and could all be only a memory... which is why my favorite thing to do with a computer is to learn how to do things which do not involve a computer. On the other hand, unless my home is utterly destroyed, I will probably have one or more of my instruments to keep playing music on. If it is utterly destroyed, then the computers are gone as well, if not myself and my family.

    As I am writing this, I am beginning to understand the big difference. Some people want to "make" music, as a manufactured product or a commodity. On the other hand, I want to play music and initiate a sound. A sound, in and of itself, is not a commodity until it is recorded. When a sound is initiated, it travels out into existence, effecting reality in unpredictable ways, slowly dampened by matter and competing energy it finally diminishes into nothing. Only it's effect and/or memory remains. This is why a music performer CAN become a commodity in and of themselves, because of the effect that they have and the memory of that effect.
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    neuromancer56 : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago @JosephFunk: Everyone knows Beatles>Stones>Aerosmith. I like them all, though probably Beatles & Aerosmith more than the Stones. The Stones have some real klinkers. Michael Jackson is so hard to evaluate because I've heard the stuff from Thriller a billion times. And though I thought he was nutty, I'm probably more impressed by "Beat It" than any other song. It really transcends genre. Is it rock? Is it R&B? Is it pop? No one has accomplished anything that comes close. Not even Prince. Beat It rocks harder than just about any Rock song I've heard. Wish Michael would have done more rock, but once you've created perfection, why bother? Van Halen would have been better off with Michael as their lead singer rather than Sammy Hagar. Michael>Prince. Though Prince is funkier and cooler. Imagine Prince trying to sing Beat It. Not gonna happen.
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    wikkid : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Prince and Michael were somewhat friendly rivals. There are a number of YouTube videos showing Prince covering Michael. (covering I Want You Back) There are a number of other videos with Prince's band covering Michael Jackson tunes.

    They respected each other's talent and Chris Tucker has some funny material on Michael going to a Prince concert in Vegas (Chris Tucker and Mike hung out together)
    According to Chris, both Mike and Prince were fun guys off stage.
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    Spivkurl : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago Can someone clue me in to what this thread is about?
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    Planetjazzbass : Sun 8th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago @Spiv lol!...Total randomization, if neuromancer applied half as much effort into learning an instrument as he does conceptualising about imaginary scenarios maybe he'd get some real traction and move forward (this is not a put down just a suggestion)
  24. 2276282
    neuromancer56 : Mon 9th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago @PJB: Shucks, you and Spivkurl are just gonna have to learn to love me for who I am. Heck I can't even create a decent beat in REAPER yet. I just downloaded my first Kick VST. I don't even know how to use a synth yet. I know there's oscillators, additive, subtractive, samlpers, but I'll be darned if I know what any of that means or how to get any decent sounds out of one. First I gotta master that stuff. I'm just doing this stuff for kicks n giggles.
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    Spivkurl : Mon 9th Oct 2017 : 11 months ago I'll have to take PJB's word on this, since there were no other suggestions in response to my question.

    I suppose it doesn't matter much. I also know that I tend to take certain things more seriously than intended. Sorry about that.
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